charlieannear Posted March 21, 2006 Report Share Posted March 21, 2006 Employed my newly learned splicing talents this evening and my mate had a look at my eye splice and (as he always does) offered me his opinion, which being a flappy-fabric-power type of mariner was "It could do with a bigger loop mate" So, my question to you guys is: How big a loop do your eye splices have, and why? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Afishionado Posted March 21, 2006 Report Share Posted March 21, 2006 Idealy one that when placed over your deck cleats does not fall off of it's own accord. The loop should be a tight fit over the cleat in question. Mad Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncan Posted March 21, 2006 Report Share Posted March 21, 2006 goin' to have to disagree Mike any loop that goes one way over a cleat can go the other way and is not therefore 'safe' for anything but a temporary hold. loop should be of a reasonably long length - around 10/12 inches should do - and will be passed throught the base of the cleat and back over the top to secure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Afishionado Posted March 21, 2006 Report Share Posted March 21, 2006 loop should be of a reasonably long length - around 10/12 inches should do - and will be passed throught the base of the cleat and back over the top to secure. As indeed mine are, but a lot of cleats have a solid base so I recommend a loop that is a tight fit over the horns. If the cleat has a slotted base then it still works the way you and I fit them anyway. Mad Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
great white Posted March 21, 2006 Report Share Posted March 21, 2006 But Duncan surely Mike's loop would also do that you just have to pass it further through first including the splice. then pull the splice back under the cleat after dopping the loop on. a longer loop could be passed around the cleat more than once to prevent it bouncing off, but then a round turn and two half hitches would do that just as well, without shortening the rope by splicing it. Charlie I think the answer is really that it depends what you spliced the loop in for mate. The important thing is the number of tucks, at least 5 on man made fibres and three on natural in a three core rope splice. Charlie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomBettle Posted March 21, 2006 Report Share Posted March 21, 2006 Sorry to dissapoint you both, but the eye should infact be attached to the cleat on the pontoon / mooring and only "temporarily" attached to the boat with the mooring rope actually living on the pontoon. However, this is not practical in day to day use and normally only reserved for bigger boats and their regular "home" mooring. It is done by some of our older colleagues (grrr Geoff), probably as a ploy to annoy their younger team mates in an effort to slow down departure from the mooring, or to watch whilst hilariously falling around laughing as we untie the wrong end of the boat first (down wind or down tide end) innoncently believing we can slip the line off the other end in a swift slight of hand style movement, then realising our error as the boat swings off the mooring whilst you are stll fumbling around with the damn line. In day to day use, most of us will do what Duncan suggests. Where the cleat ha a solid base, we would tend to hook the eye (a small one) over one end of the cleat and then make it secure with a couple of turns so that it can't fall off. Grrrr, not sure why I replied to this now! I am tired and only came over to turn my pc off. Sorry for completely unrelated, unimportant reply to the post written in a long winded and garbled way... ...but I guess you have come to expect that from me. Tom Ps I haven't even been drinking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncan Posted March 21, 2006 Report Share Posted March 21, 2006 being in a disagreeing mood I will conntinue with Tom.... it could be argued that you shouldn't actually make a line off to shore but run it back to the boat to be slipped on departure.............if you are coming alongside another boat, or shore, you will normally have the loop attached toyour boat and pass the bitter end over to the other boat. Admittedly this is going to depend heavily on how many crew involved on which boat! small cleats with a fixed base are only suitable for lines to be made off to rather than a loop being placed over them! nice 6/8mm lines matching them nicely! and Charlie - yes, well spotted. HOwever there are principles at stake here!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toerag Posted March 22, 2006 Report Share Posted March 22, 2006 and to throw a spanner in the works, I have loops on the boat end of my permanent mooring for the springs, and a simple rope for the direct lines, ie. I have a stern and midships cleats with matching attachments on the pontoon. I moor up with the eyed lines (springs) then use the other lines to attach the boat tightly to the finger. The cleats aren't big enough for 2 cleated off ropes, so one has to have an eye. Bow mooring is done with 2 eyes, one from each side. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueboatdriver Posted March 22, 2006 Report Share Posted March 22, 2006 This mooring up business can get a bit complicated can't it. It's not just a case of getting along side and going straight home is it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomBettle Posted March 22, 2006 Report Share Posted March 22, 2006 This mooring up business can get a bit complicated can't it. It's not just a case of getting along side and going straight home is it. Simon The next time I see the Sherwood "Not under command", bobbing across Poole harbour all on her own I am not bringing her back for you! I didn't mind the first time, but every day is becomming a bit much. Also, next time, remember to take the keys out and lock the door! Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncan Posted March 22, 2006 Report Share Posted March 22, 2006 I'm similar toerag - bow line looped, mid boat to rear pontoon spring looped then poontoon back to rear boat cleat made off as required. then there are the chains and padlocks.............. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Fox Posted March 22, 2006 Report Share Posted March 22, 2006 It can get fun if you have to "raft out" when mooring up, in places like Yarmouth and Weymouth particularly. You then need bow and stern lines to the inside boat, with fore and aft springs to maintain position. In addition, you will need shore lines to help prevent the whole raft from sliding down tide - ideally fore and aft. I keep a couple of 90' ropes specially for shore lines - but found them too short in Weymouth more than once when on the outside of a dozen or so other boats - average beam of 10' or more. When rafting, it can be entertaining slipping out from the middle, if you want an early morning departure. You have to detach all shore lines outside of you, slip out, then they will then need reconnecting (ideally with someone else on the raft helping). The French technique is less popular... just cast everyone off outside you.... Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomBettle Posted March 22, 2006 Report Share Posted March 22, 2006 It can get fun if you have to "raft out" when mooring up, in places like Yarmouth and Weymouth particularly. When rafting, it can be entertaining slipping out from the middle, if you want an early morning departure. You have to detach all shore lines outside of you, slip out, then they will then need reconnecting (ideally with someone else on the raft helping). Mike Weymouth is notorious for the boat in the middle wanting an early start at 03:00 in the morning. If you ever go and find yourselves rafted I would suggest that you make arrangements with you raft mates to allow you to be the outside boat as it never goes down well when everyone needs waking up to help you move. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Afishionado Posted March 22, 2006 Report Share Posted March 22, 2006 First off to Duncan.......Yer what Charlie said, so there! Second to Tom ........ Oh Bl00dy dock lines eh!! Pontoon Berths!! You'll be talking about your paid crew next and summers in St Trop' Third.... Quote.. it could be argued that you shouldn't actually make a line off to shore but run it back to the boat to be slipped on departure............. COULD BE ARGUED!!!!!! My fishing partner Mark drives me mad (and I sure he does it on purposely to wind me up now!) by tieing the boat up to to the fuel pontoon at Cobbs where I can get on easily with my gammy back, with 86 turns round the dock bollard topped with 43 granny knots!!! I prefer a turn round the bollard then back to a midships cleat on the boat. This can be undone from the helm seat and as one motors slowly off one just picks up the return end off the bollard. Mad Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomBettle Posted March 22, 2006 Report Share Posted March 22, 2006 This can be undone from the helm seat and as one motors slowly off one just picks up the return end off the bollard. Mad Mike "As one slowly motors off" !!! I've seen ya! If it isn't all merry hell braking loose as the boat spins round in the tide and gets blown sideways in the wind against all the other boats then it is getting progressively more panicky as you try to turn the bow into the wind and end up shooting forwards and backwards at near planning speed until there is the inevitable crunch as your anchor finds your berth neighbours gel-coat! Oh no, that wasn't you! That was new member Geoff during his first session in one of our stock boats!!!! ...sorry Geoff, had to get that one in... ...oh and Martin "Snag Man" has become known as Mangler Mcintyre for his excessive "fender testing" too... ... I never knew that fenders had that much "bounce" in them allowing one to zig zag all of the way down a gap between two rows of boats big enough to get the QM II through. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Afishionado Posted March 22, 2006 Report Share Posted March 22, 2006 One of the greatest pleasures in boating is sitting watching the efforts, gyrations and sheer lunacy of the inexperianced coming into or going out from a slip or dock. These characters usualy have a large, powerful craft and seem oblivious of the fact that a boat does not behave like a car, and also Newtons third law of motion. Infact the Newtons third law bit can be REALY funny. Mad Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueboatdriver Posted March 22, 2006 Report Share Posted March 22, 2006 Wos that then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Afishionado Posted March 22, 2006 Report Share Posted March 22, 2006 Oh no one specifically, but sitting on the side of the slip at Cobbs is worth the money for that alone Or even better the fuel barg on a breezy summers day with wind over tide. I s'pose I must have a cruel sence of humour Mad Mike (hanging head in deep shame ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam F Posted March 22, 2006 Report Share Posted March 22, 2006 Blimey!....you can tell you you havent been out in a while, what a heated debate this one is!! For what its worth, I have never bothered with loops at any end - instead I just have plain ended rope to serve a multitude of purposes - my favorite fixing? a couple of 'figures of eight' with a half hitch on the top - had served me fine. KISS basically..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueboatdriver Posted March 22, 2006 Report Share Posted March 22, 2006 Mad, It wasn't 'who's' that, it was 'what's' that; Newton's third law of whatever it was. Boat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Afishionado Posted March 22, 2006 Report Share Posted March 22, 2006 Oh. Mr Newton, I see........ 18th Century Scientist the 'father of physics' Discovered gravity with an apple and a tree, oh and the ground the apple fell on. 3rd law 'Every action has an equal and oposite reaction' This is illustrated graphically when a person tries to jump from a dinghy to a dock. The dinghy goes backward as far as the jump forward thus doubling the distance to jump. Consequences inevitable and wet. Mad Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueboatdriver Posted March 22, 2006 Report Share Posted March 22, 2006 nice explanation Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crazy fred Posted March 23, 2006 Report Share Posted March 23, 2006 i cant agree that every action has an eqaul reaction because when someone looses a bass i dont catch another i just call them sodding useless or words to that effect Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueboatdriver Posted March 23, 2006 Report Share Posted March 23, 2006 Is that creature eating your nuts, Crazy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Fox Posted March 23, 2006 Report Share Posted March 23, 2006 I once shared my lugworm with the snotty--nosed kid on the beach next to me who then promptly caught a 9.5 lb bass to my blank session. Was that an example of Newton's Third? Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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