Fuel Tank Filling

[kaptin kod]

Went to my local garage last weekend to fill up one of my fuel tanks, one of the girls came running accross to tell me I was breaking the law by filling a container with more than the 10 litre limit for a container and that even by storing that amount in a garage was illegal too. Do you get this sort of problem?.

 

Think I'll recommend her for the jobsworth trophy.

 

 

[Adam F]

KK,

 

I have never had this - I frequently fill up my two tanks with up to 50 ltrs and my local garage never bats and eyelid - however, officially I think she is correct. Somehting to do with explosive risks etc - apparently you can also only carry 10 ltrs spare in the boot of your car.

 

Just find another garage....

[Newboy]

That's why I always fill up with the boat on way to slipway.

[duncan]

As Adam say's she is simply enforcing th eregulations.

 

I do not see this as a jobsworth - if you work for a large firm and take no action when someone fails to comply with notices posted on the forecort you will not be working long!

 

Kam's solution is the best and the argument is that you are filing fuel tanks installed in a vehicle (boat) in the same way as anyone filling a car/lorry! ie not a container.

 

Alternatively do it surrepticiously................

[Afishionado]

OK guys, I have just spoken to a 5hitty little jobs worth at Bournemouth Trading Standards. After trying to get past his jobsworthness on the point of Retailers CHOISE I found out the following. There is NO law prohibiting the sale or supply of petrol into a 5 gallon(25ltr) purpose made container, to be used in an internal combustion engine subsequently. However a retailer for his own reasons may refuse to sell one petrol. BUT IT CERTAINLY IS NOT AGAINST THE LAW and therefore it is perfectly within the law. But all the retailer has to say is "I don't want to serve you anyway" and you cant make him sell you fuel

 

HOWEVER IT IS AN OFFENCE TO STORE MORE THAN ONE AND A QUARTER GALLONS IN THE HOME OR GARAGE.

 

So if you are filling an empty tank on the way to go fishing that day you are not breaking any law. Filling it up today for a trip tomorrow and storing the tank in or arround your property brakes the law.

 

There is a futher complication if one wishes to be pedantic........ Each county/bourough councill has it's own guide lines. Some administered by the Fire Service some by Trading Standards.

 

So basicaly if you ask the right question to get clarification and a jobsworth answers, you might as well not have bothered. Just find another petrol station!

 

Mad Mike

[duncan]

nice one Mike

 

sorry if the use of the word regulations in my post implied legal issues - I was simply highlighting that if BP (for example) posts a notice (to customers) and informs staff they have to enforce it, then that member of staff isn't a 'jobsworth'.

 

as you say arguing that the firms rules aren't necessarily reflecting the legal position is as pointless as it is crass.

[charlieannear]

I suspect that the offence that Mad Mike just shouted out for us is to put off hoarders rather than boaters isn't it?

 

After all, surely fuel that is stored in a fuel can, manufactured for the purpose of storing fuel isn't a safety risk.

Edited June 15, 2006 by charlieannear

[Newboy]

Storing large amount of petrol in the garage isn't very clever. If you have a fire at home and everyone is evacuated outside, I think the fire brigate would rather be told 'oh, I've 5 litres of petrol in the garage' than 'oh, I've 125 litres ......'

[blueboatdriver]

Just say, "sorry I won't do it again" you'll probably never get spotted again. The profesional clam fishermen fill 4 to 6 cans at a time and get away wiht it. I don't think they like you leaving the cans in hte back of your vehicle whilst filling either,

 

Simon.

[Member Removed]

The law on fuel is crazy, if your tank is plastic you can only put 5lts in if it is not attatched to the engine of the boat. Connect it to your engine and you can fill it whatever the size. If the tank is metal you can put 25 litres in it off the boat.

[Swainiac]

To put another spanner in the works, its also illegal to store ANY size fuel can in the boot of a car IF the bulkhead of that vehicle is not seperate from the passenger carrying body, ie, if the seats fold down to leave an open boot space, technically you can reported for summons. Its all about fumes and driver consciousness.

 

Rich

[Newboy]

Rich, is that the same for LPG? Cos a lot of the gas conversion have the gas tank in the boot nowaday.

[blueboatdriver]

You're right it does stink the car out but what else can you do? Just wind the windows down I suppose.

[Paul D]

From the HSE web site here :-

 

Rules

 

( Note there are no rules wrt. filling containers )

 

============================================

 

PORTABLE PETROL CONTAINERS

1 This circular aims to explain the law on the type and capacity of portable petrol containers that can be used to store petrol, filled at petrol stations and carried on vehicles.

 

2 There are three pieces of relevant legislation:

 

- the Petroleum (Consolidation) Act 1928 (PCA);

 

- the Petroleum-Spirit (Motor Vehicles etc.) Regulations 1929; and

 

- the Petroleum-Spirit (Plastic Containers) Regulations 1982 (which is supported by an ACoP on testing and marking containers).

 

3 These control how petrol can be kept (and for plastic containers, their design and manufacture for use in work situations). They do not specify the capacity or construction of containers that can legally be filled at petrol filling stations or that can be carried on a vehicle travelling on the road.

 

The Petroleum (Consolidation) Act 1928

4 PCA requires a licence to keep petrol except for small quantities kept in "securely stopped glass, earthenware or metal containers of a maximum capacity of 570 mls". The total quantity kept in this way must not exceed 15 litres.

 

METAL CONTAINERS

5 The Petroleum-Spirit (Motor Vehicles etc.) Regulations 1929 exempt certain quantities of petrol kept in metal containers from licensing requirements. The petrol must only be kept for the purposes of refuelling internal combustion engines and must not be for sale.

 

6 Up to 275 litres of petrol can be kept in any one storage place without a licence. The allowable quantity is reduced when the petrol is kept in or near buildings, or near public thoroughfares or other flammable substances (see below). In calculating the 275 litre limit, the petrol in the fuel tanks of vehicles in the storage area is included in the total.

 

7 Metal containers must be constructed so as to be reasonably secure against breakage and to prevent leakage of liquid or vapour. They should be marked with the words "petroleum-spirit" and "highly flammable".

 

8 The maximum container capacity for keeping petrol is 10 litres unless the following conditions are met:

 

a) the storage place is more than 6m from a building, highway or public footpath,and;

 

there is spillage retention at the storage place (eg retaining wall, trench), and;

 

c) the licensing authority is given written notice of the storage place before it is used.

 

This does not include petrol in the fuel tank of a vehicle.

 

9 Note that there is no restriction on the number of containers that can be kept as long as the 275 litre maximum limit is not passed.

 

10 If the storage place is less than 6m from any building, stack of timber or other inflammable substance it can only be kept in the fuel tank of a vehicle and up to two 10 litre containers on a motor vehicle, motor boat, aircraft or hovercraft unless notice in writing is given to the licensing authority.

 

11 Where petrol is kept in a building (or a place attached to a building) used as a dwelling or place where people assemble, there must be a substantial floor or partition separating the petrol storage from the rest of building. The floor or partition must not be readily inflammable. Where the partition (not a floor) has an opening it must be fitted with a self closing door made of fire resisting material. In these circumstances a maximum of two 10 litres containers can be kept. Petrol in the fuel tank of a vehicle is not included in this amount.

 

PLASTIC CONTAINERS

12 The Petroleum-Spirit (Plastic Containers) Regulations 1982 allow plastic containers to be used as well as metal. They exempt from the need for a licence certain amounts of petrol kept in plastic containers for the purposes of refuelling internal combustion engines and not for sale.

 

13 For storage in plastic container without a licence the containers must:

 

a) be constructed of suitable materials;

 

have maximum capacity of five litres;

 

c) be designed and constructed properly;

 

d) have appropriate markings or labels;

 

and the quantities that can be stored are:

 

i) two containers can be kept on any motor vehicle, motor boat, aircraft or hovercraft;

 

ii) plus two further containers can be in a safe place in any domestic premises;

 

iii) plus two more containers can be kept in any other safe place at least 6m from the first.

 

These quantities are in addition to any petrol kept in metal containers.

 

14 Where a petrol licence is in force, the conditions in paragraph 13 do not apply, but storage has to be in accordance with any licence conditions.

 

15 It is an offence to manufacture, import or supply containers for use at work which do not meet the requirement of sub-paragraphs 13 a) to d). Details on the testing and marking of plastic containers are available in HSE's Approved Code of Practice COP 6. It is not necessarily an offence to keep containers not meeting 13 a) - d) as long as a licence is in force.

 

CARRIAGE OF PETROL

16 PCA and it's associated regulations do not exercise any control over the carriage of petrol on vehicles for private or work use.

 

17 The commercial carriage of petrol is covered by two sets of HSE enforced regulations:

 

- the Carriage of Dangerous Goods by Road Regulations 1996 (CDG); and

 

- the Carriage of Dangerous Goods (Classification, Packaging and Labelling) and Use of Transportable Pressure Receptacles Regulations 1996 (CDGCPL).

 

18 These regulations include requirements for design and marking of the packaging or containers used. The packaging must be suitable for the purpose, having regard to the substances they contain and be appropriately marked. PLAs should direct queries to the local HSE office.

 

19 These regulations are solely concerned with the commercial transport of hazardous substances and do not cover petrol carried on a vehicle for private use.

 

SUMMARY

20 At filling stations, there is no specific legal restriction on the type or number of containers that can be filled (although Petroleum Licensing Authorities often use licensing conditions to limit the containers sizes). The legal limits are on how and where they are subsequently kept.

 

21 Carriage of petrol is not covered by petroleum legislation. However, petroleum licensing officers should advise filling station operators to ensure that only containers suitable for the purpose are filled.

 

[shytalk]

get a diesel

[toerag]

Just thought that I'd add that you can no longer buy the red plastic jerrycans as they're illegal or something.

Well, you can still buy them, but they've stopped making them. I use 25litre chemical drums and fill 4 up at a time, but I live in the CI where we don't have health and safety.........

[plaicemat]

Or your system works the same way the French one does, i.e., ignore it!

 

Terry B.