Sunday 23rd

[Coddy]

Bill and I took Sammy out for a spin in the harbour.

 

A nice day albeit a bit windy but not unfishable.

 

Tried drifting for place & flounder but no takers apart from a bream caught by Bill, have not been able to identify it yet, think it is a Gilthead but unsure as never seen one or a Couch Bream, moved down to Rockley but still no luck.

 

Moved back up the harbour and managed a small schoolie bass.

 

By 3pm the drizzle started so we packed up and headed homeward.

 

Picture of bream attached if anyone can help

 

Couch Bream

 

 

Coddy

[Mike Fox]

hi Dave,

Yellow bar over the bridge of the nose and eye would suggest a Gilthead bream.

 

Lovely fish aren't they!

 

Mike

[Adam F]

Its a Couch's Bream.

 

The Giltheads do have the gold bar, but they are more like a black bream - a rare catch dave.

 

Well done!

[corky]

yes definatley Pagrus pagrus (was Sparus pagrus) or Couches bream. Also often just called common bream, caught regularly in the channel isles and abundant in the Bay of Biscay and mediteranian. What a treat to catch one here - well done. see attached link.

http://www.glaucus.org.uk/Pagrus.htm

[Paul D]

Coddy,

 

I have let Douglas Herdson of the National Aquarium know as well ( via e-mail ) as they are always interested in unusual captures.

 

 

[Mike Fox]

Interesting comparison with this one:

 

http://web.ukonline.co.uk/aquarium/pics/gilthead02.jpg

 

 

I'm still not convinced - Gilthead looks a closer match to me.

 

Mike

Edited September 23, 2007 by Paul D

[Paul D]

Interesting comparion with this one as well

 

A bit bigger

 

[alun j.]

No Mike!.........it's the background colour that's the big difference!

[Coddy]

Interesting comparison with this one:

 

http://web.ukonline.co.uk/aquarium/pics/gilthead02.jpg

 

I'm still not convinced - Gilthead looks a closer match to me.

 

Mike

Hi Mike

 

I agree it does look like a Gilthead but then the markings are different on the body.

 

As you can see Bill's fish was only a small one and the Gilthead get to some size!

 

As you can see my first thoughts were Couch Bream, time will tell.

 

Must have been all of 4 to 6ozs so I suppose a young one.

 

If it was young I want the Mum or Dad version!

 

Coddy

Edited September 23, 2007 by Coddy

[Mike Fox]

Hi Coddy,

Having caught a few Gilthead Bream in the past (one last week!), I remember that they have crushing teeth inside that look like tiny cobblestones on bony pads.

 

See http://www.fao.org/docrep/005/x3980e/x3980e05.htm

 

The Couch's bream piccie that Corky put up shows a set of dentures that Dick Emery would be proud of.

 

When you unhooked it, what was the mouth like? This should privide DEFINITIVE identification.

 

By the way, with a fish of 4-6 oz, it would still have had juvenile colouring, and this will be less of an indication of species than you might think.

 

Mike

PS If you were close to the plaice mark I gave you, that's where I caught my Gilthead!

Edited September 24, 2007 by Mike Fox

[Neal]

 

 

I have caught loads of these in the harbour and always assumed that the Gold colouring on the Gill plates meant it was a Gilthead Bream - with or without serious dentistry. I await the official respose eagerly.

 

I decided to go a tad further afield yesterday with the plan to go to Swanage Bay

 

It was a bit rough so went further into Durlston Bay ..... very rough especialy crossing Peverel Ledge. Wind over tide.

 

Loads of fish showing on the fish finder - probably sheltering from the huge waves off the end of the point. But not a single bite - tried a multitude of different baits but to no avail.

 

I thought that as the tide slackened the waves should flatten out and once the flood started should be quite confortable,so I headed out to my usual blonde ray mark.

 

It wasnt too bad getting out with the following sea and wind. We managed to anchor up in about the right spot. We even managed to fish catching good sized Black Bream, Bass (48cm) and strap congers, with mackerel being caught sporadically on a set of feathers hung over the side. A definate improvement over the last few weeks fishing.

 

The supposed flattening off of the waves didn't happen and the wind kept increasing. It was interesting to watch the occasional wave breaking above the level of the top of cabin. The fish finder was showing the wave height from top to bottom of over 10ft.

 

I was amazed the anchor held and that we could fish relatively comfortably - but I don't think I would have wanted to be out in a smaller boat.

 

By 4.00pm the rain started and the wind increased and the tide picked up - so decided to head back in.

 

Very impressed with the way the Arvor 250 handled the conditions and would not hesitate to recommend one to anybody thinking of purchasing this kind of boat.

 

Can't fish now until the end of October - probably shouldn't have ventured out yesterday - we were all warned - (couldn't go Saturday!) - Hope you all manage a successful months fishing and see you out their soon.

 

 

Neal and crew

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[great white]

Well done Dave

 

I am sure it could be identified from the photo by someone

 

If it were weighed I am sure it would be a club record now that we have agreed to expand the Clubs existing lists and sub divide the various species, I can not remember either of the two probable species being on the record list at the moment.

 

Nice looking fish, It would be good if we are starting to see giltheads as they are a bigger species

 

Charlie

 

 

[toerag]

All the pics I've seen of giltheads show the body to be silver. The shape of both species is very similar, but the couch's are always pink in coloration. Having said that, I don't know if a juvenile gilthead has a pink tinge to it.

Either way - both fight like mad so it's all good news!

edit - excellent photos here:-

http://www.sealordphotography.net/gallery/1988836#101520368

 

I think it's a juvenile gilty - look at the black and red markings on the gill covers.

[Coddy]

Paul D sent off my picture for a positive ID of the Bream.

 

The reply was as follows;

-----------------------------------------

Hi Paul

 

This is a young Gilthead Sea Bream Sparus aurata. Head shape, golden bar between eyes, but especially the dark blotch at top of operculum and dark edge to tail. Couch

[great white]

well done Coddy and Paul for following this up

 

and to those that correctly identified the fish, as I said earlier I hope its an indication of some of these arriving in our waters

 

Is that a new record Paul?

 

Charlie

[Mike Fox]

I recorded the capture of an utterly maginificent 13oz Gilthead the week before, as in my post...but didn't pop it into the catch reports, fearing the wrath of the mini-fish ruling.

 

Fortunately it was witnessed by Carol and George, but no piccie taken.

 

I know Neal has had a few on Court Jester too - but no weights seen from him.

 

Mike

[great white]

Cool

 

I had missed the earlier posts, or forgot after returning from holiday

 

Glad a few of these are being landed, If we have the youngsters I wonder where the breeding stock are?

 

Congratulations Mike another potential Club Record to FF.

 

Charlie

 

 

[Mike Fox]

Congrats really to Dave who raised this debate, and Paul who provided the definitive answer.

 

Mike