Club rules & Flounder Bash

[Sprinter]

Hi guys and Gals

I have a couple of points, one a proposal one a question I have not approached anyone regarding this so I have no idea how it will be received, if things seem generally favourable I will propose it at the next meeting and put it to the committee.

 

Proposal 1

I would like to propose that the rule which states that two people per boat must be present during competitions for safety reasons is re-written.

 

I agree with it of course in principal, but I suspect it was written before anyone though about fishing from a Kayak. Kayak safety goes along the lines of paddle with a fellow kayaker and we are taught to carry out self and assisted rescues for this reason.

 

What I would like to see is a re-write or amendment that allows Kayaker

[Brian]

As far as I know, the Sept comp is the only "Open" comp.

 

I think the small change to the rules to allow Kayaks to fish in pairs makes sense.

[Maverick Martin]

Hi Paul

 

Our flounder comp is for club members only so your friends would not be able to fish the comp unless they joined. Our only competition thats open for none members is our Open Specimen comp held in September this year.

 

Re: 2 in a boat rule. If fishing a competition your crew members do not have to be club members however their catch is not counted. The 2 man rule is purely for safety and nothing else. Not sure how this would or indeed could work with a kayak?

 

We have pondered over kayakers for a while and even asked a former forum member if he would be interested in fronting a kayak section of the club, he declined.

 

Personally I am not against a kayaking section but am a little apprehensive about the implications for the club. A lot of the apprehension is probably down to ignorance so perhaps you could sell the idea to us

 

Re: proposals. Any member can bring forward a proposal to the AGM (April meeting) You would though need to put if forward by the February meeting so the membership and committee can consider it prior to voting.

 

Hope that helps

 

Martin

[Rob]

 

I think the idea of Yacks in the club is good. But what is "fishing in pairs"? Would you be in radio contact, sight of each other, attached to the same anchor?

 

I think it is open to discussion as that condition in a comp could be abused and we wouldn't want anything happen to a club member, especially in a comp.

 

Perhaps a Yak run through and demo (bring one to a meeting) woudl be interesting.

 

Rob

[Sprinter]

What is fishing in pairs.

 

Thats a very good question, one that needs to be debated and agreed on (even assuming we get enough interest), personally i would say 50m, as you are in little danger of getting trapped under one, only stuck in the water beside one (or taken by the current downstream when the Yak is at anchor.

 

Im not the pushy type and as said im only floating an idea, or two.

 

As for a Demo, give me some time to have a think about that, im not averse to the idea of bringing mine up with some of my kits to let you have a look around it, might make for an interesting evening for everyone.

Edited September 21, 2009 by Zed

[great white]

A very interesting thread.

 

It would be good to have a kyaker bring his equipment to a meeting and give the members present, a presentation on what rig is carried and how they are fished etc

 

A backdrop of some of the recent reports would also be interesting.

 

As to the proposal

It is well worth bringing to the next AGM, but lay it out. so that there is no doubt about what is considered pair fishing. and what is a mimimum standard of safety equipment to be carried. and clothing worn.

 

If in a boat the second person does not have to be a member or even a fisherman.

So perhaps nor would the second Kyaker.

 

My only concern is the safety aspect.

 

As for the Flounder comp and comparing catches, nothing to stop you and your friends fishing on the same day and then reporting your successes on here to compare notes.

Or you could launch near the weigh in position and bring your fish to the scales, I am sure nobody would mind an unofficial second weigh in.

 

Just my thoughts

Charlie

 

 

[Paul J]

A very interesting thread.

PJ

[codpiece]

When is the flounder bash please, Derek.

[Wedger]

 

http://www.pbsbac.co.uk/forums/index.php?showtopic=8326

 

A pinned thread in comp talk has all the dates Del.

 

seek, and ye shall find

 

Edited September 22, 2009 by Wedger

[codpiece]

 

seek, and ye shall find

 

:

Only borrowed Trev,

[Paul J]

It would be good if this subject can be debated through to a conclusion and a consensus reached to whether we have a proposal that can be put to the commitee and voted on at the AGM.

 

Thats not until April so we should be able to flush out all the issues and come up with a practical solution that everybodys happy with by then?.

 

As Martin said the over-riding issue that the commitee will be concerned about is safety and whether the committee is willing to take on increased risk if thats what it amounts to.

 

Some other items for discussion would be:

 

Does the club want a kayak section and how would it effect the club as a whole - would it cause divisions or add to our already diverse group?

 

How will it effect competitions?

How many other rules need to be changed to accommodate single passenger craft?

Are there any objections? on what basis?

 

This could be a fundemental shift from where we are now so i'd like to get as much honest feedback as possible from as many different people as possible so we can gauge iinterest and allow ZED to decide if it's worth pursuing. By the way thanks for raising it, i'll stay out of it as i have a vested interest being a keen yaker myself

 

Cheers

 

PJ

[Sinbad]

Paul,

Good points,

only when the resolution is duly voted on, I hope someone remembers to write it into the constitution and put it in a safe place (i.e on the website)

 

Did the mamouth vote of two AGM's ago ever get written as above.....?

 

I think we tried to define what constituted a boat and how many club members needed to be on board etc etc.

The three hook rule we voted on for club comps seems to have been forgotten -(re the last open comp rules), and I'm not sure what was voted on now it was so long ago.

 

Would some kind sole help, either produce the minutes of the last but one AGM or show me where this was written down ?

 

yours cheekily

 

Paul

 

 

[Coddy]

Hi Paul

 

Minutes of the 2007 AGM are still on the web site

http://www.pbsbac.co.uk/forums/index.php?showtopic=7229

 

for the 2008 minutes look here

http://www.pbsbac.co.uk/forums/index.php?showtopic=7561

 

Club constitution is here

http://www.pbsbac.co.uk/forums/index.php?showtopic=7230

 

Regarding the 3 hook rule I sent a proposal in but it was amended and agreed by your good self.

 

The constitution only advises that there is a minimum of two people on a boat.

 

What did surprise me was the low number of views for the minutes of meetings and AGM's.

 

I personally would like to see kayaks included into the club as I feel it would make the club stronger, attract more members and may even bring improved fishing skills which can be passed on to other club members.

I do think however that there would be a need for a kayak owner to be on the committee so that, "that" group of members can have their voices heard at committee level, they may well hold another post as well.

 

I don't see any problem in kayaks fishing our club competitions with the proviso of a minimum of two kayaks fishing within, say, 250yrds of each other for safety reasons.

 

After all we are the Poole Bay "Small Boats" Angling Club

 

Dave

Edited September 23, 2009 by Coddy

[Maverick Martin]

The constitution is for the governance of the club only so competition rules should not be written in there. Competition rules are normally written on the annual competition sheet although I think they should be available as a separate document and stored on here somewhere

 

Martin

[Wedger]

What a great discussion!

 

I would seriously support a kayak section - as stated with adequate provision for safety. I do feel that the safety aspect needs careful attention but needs to be heavily weighted toward the individual in charge of the craft. We have had many discussions about this in the past and the consensus that the skipper of each boat takes ultimate responsibility should have continuity across the board IMHO.

 

I would suggest that the details of sea safety in kayaks so far as the club is concerned is discussed and presented to the club by experienced kayakers, who in turn are properly represented at committee level. So you first have to create a kayak section, and elect a rep onto committee etc etc.

 

(and I know we haven't created a 'stick & string' section, but we are now talking about 'one man craft' and not just the method of propulsion).

 

Perhaps a new thread needed............

 

nudge, nudge.............

Edited September 24, 2009 by Wedger

[Sprinter]

All,

Thanks for the input so far, I am glad we have views on this and whilst most seem positive I would also be happy if anyone with negative views voiced them as well, After all it

[Mike Fox]

Hi Zed,

I think it's a good idea for more floating anglers to join the club.

 

I believe Frisky is the only boat with sails in the club at present, is the slowest boat in the fleet under engine (and probably the slowest under sail too !), but can undertake the longest fishing trips due to the accommodation available. I've tried to compete on level terms over the last few years, but some of the anglers are really skillful, and we do struggle at times. We've certainly had fun trying, and ocasionally raise a smile when we get something decent.

 

Kayaks joining in adds to the diversity of club craft, I for one think it's a good idea, and am envious at the level of fun you guys seem to have!

 

Regarding safety, I am an RNLI Sea Safety Officer, and the RNLI has issued guidelines for kayak safety, that were developed in conjunction with an extreme kayak group, so that the Sea Safety Scheme can be extended to kayaks as well as other small private craft. This focusses on matters such as equipment to be carried. Would be more than happy to bring details to the next meeting so that we can discuss relevance for angling from kayaks within the context of the club. From what I've seen, most anglers from kayaks appear well equipped - there's nothing like utter vulnerability to focus the mind.

 

What I would suggest is that the distance between two well-equipped buddy kayaks is kept to the minimum for competition fishing. If one is to be close enough to help the other, then a minute or 5 apart might just be too long to avoid a disaster. I think this will be a key matter in any decision taken.

 

Mike

 

 

[great white]

An interesting thread developing.

 

It would be great to get as many views as possible. I have stated mine.

 

But would like to agree with Mike that if two Kyakers are fishing together, they surely must need to be very close if they are covering each other for safety reasons.

 

Paul I was wondering why you are refraining from comment as in your words

" i'll stay out of it as i have a vested interest being a keen yaker myself"

 

IMHO a view from a senior Member of the Committee who is a keen angler and has an interest in boats and Kyaks would be vary valid.

 

Charlie

 

 

[petesnr]

I cant really see why kayakers need a new committee member especially as our illustrious chairman is a part time kayaker himself.

We dont specify much about the types of boats allowed in our club only an upper limit on length so the only difference is the question of buddying for safety reasons.

The major difference here is that instead of a fishing unit being one boat, one skipper plus crew, the fishing unit for competition purposes in kayaks would be two craft and two skippers.

I agree that the time taken to get to help a fellow kayaker is the critical factor in determining how far apart the kayaks should be and discussion with experienced kayakers is the way forward.

As to a list of equipment--we've been here before. if we specify a list then we enter the realms of equipment checks and responsibility as a committee.

The responsibility for safety equipment has to rest with the skippers as any check would only be like an MOT i.e. valid at the time of the check. The equipment present on board for each trip would not be verifiable by the committee.

 

The proposed RNLI checklist for kayaks is the answer here to give skippers a point of reference from which they can equip their craft and it would be up to them to maintain that level of safety gear.

 

Petesnr

[Jim]

This could start people complaining that they should be allowed to fish from Tender sized dinghies, as long as they're in pairs.

Have fun with the wording chaps.

 

Jim

[petesnr]

There's nothing stopping people fishing from tenders--most will take two people of average size. Perhaps we should only allow two man kayaks!

[Rob]

 

Does this mean 2 single handed boats can fish a comp as long as they are close to each other?

 

Definition of "close" please?

 

My worry for Yaks is that I am assuming the distance may not be far but being at anchor could slow any rescue attempt unless the rope was buoyed and ready to release?

 

On the drift - how long would it take a Yak to help a friend if they were 50 yds apart in a big sea with wind and tide against them?

 

I know we have the same issues potentially on Boats but many of us have initial rescue devices to throw to an overboard crew member.

 

This is where a demo \ talk from an experience Yaker would really help.

 

R

 

[codpiece]

 

thI believe Frisky is e only boat with sails in the club at present,

Trevor's got a sailing boat.!!!

[Paul J]

Paul I was wondering why you are refraining from comment

 

 

Charlie,

 

I'll have my say but towards the end, Due to my position, i don't want to be seen as trying to steer or influence this in anyway as it's whats best for the club that matters

 

PJ

[Zzippy]

Just seen this interesting thread

A few of us have been trying for a few years to get into Flounder comps on Kayaks all over the country,but certain rules have always hit us back.

When I go out fishing with a buddy(pairs) we tend to fish about 30 feet apart and are on a quick release system to our anchor which is buoyed off,so if the worse comes to the worse we leave our anchor and retrieve later.We find any closer than 30 feet and our rigs start getting caught in each others anchor warps when the wind/tide starts moving us.

At that distance we can also Photograph each others catches

Some people have said about tandem fishing kayaks only to enter competitions.I have tried a tandem and in my eyes they are more dangerous than a single one.If one person suddenly moves it catches the second person out and that person could panic and try to steady the craft by tipping the other way.Resulting in both people in the water.

So personally I think the way to go would be a short distance apart for competitions In the harbor.

In the open sea a little bit more distance is needed to allow for the swell and current.

Safety is the first thing on our list and we take that very seriously.Nearly all of us Carry VHF Radio's,flares(inshore and smoke)GPS,Compass,First aid kits,Mobile phones for back up and lots more.

You will find that most serious kayak anglers don't go out to sea in wind more than a force 4,we take shelter in the harbor and find a nice quiet bay to fish in.

I have been a member of this great forum for about 4 years now.

I think I will go the whole way and join the club seeing as I am local to Poole and have met a few of you out on the water over the years.